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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 10/31/2008 :  04:05:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks to Mr. Clavin for creating this great gallimaufry of all things Shepherd. My old man was a listener in the early 70's when I was a "feckless youth" & I remember meeting Mr. Shepherd at a book signing in Toms River around that time (for IGWT, I believe). I've gotten the bug & have begun collecting all shows I can find.

There seem to be some shows listed in the show database (the compendium for making chronological sense of a collection like this) that are duplicates:

* "Baseball Fans" from April 1963 is actually a portion of "Imponderables" dated April 9, 1963
* show dated April 23, 1963 (which should be "Date After Army") is actually "Piano Factory Job" from April 23, 1962
* "The Snooper" (file dated 04_xx_63) seems to actually be "Bugging the Neighborhood" from July 29, 1963
* "Cause & Effect" dated April 1963 is most likely "Cause and Effect" from August 15, 1963
* the very recently posted "Mortal Fear" dated August 27, 1963 is the same show as "Where the Beautiful People Play" from August 28, 1963


As I wade through 1964 & beyond, I'll continue to make notes (with your kind indulgence) - if anyone has comments or corrections, please post them.

Thanks again for this indispensable site!

sheptapes

Tuvalu
41 Posts

Posted - 11/02/2008 :  15:38:51  Show Profile  Visit sheptapes's Homepage  Reply with Quote
There are a great many duplications in the database. Very often the undated shows at the bottom of the list can be found above with dates or slightly different titles.

There are also several duplicate listings in the new Gary Hines shows that previously existed without dates and different titles. I noticed several in Rudy's tapes that can now be dated due to the discovery of all those dated show.

Many years ago, there was an attempt to sort out all the Vic & Sade shows by indicating the opening line of the show, along with the date if known, since, like the Shep shows, they didn't have titles (well, actually the V&S have titles on the scripts, but they weren't available at the time.)

This would be a great help with the Shepherd shows, since everyone seems to focus on different parts of shows when they try to come up with a title.
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 11/11/2008 :  00:24:34  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Upon further review:

The show labeled "1964.06-xx_Agressive_Nature.mp3" (apparently from the Jean Shepherd Project) seems to actually be "Night Crawlers - Spring People; Worm Biz" also from June '64 AND the show labeled "1964.06-xx_Worms_clipped.mp3" (also apparently from the Jean Shepherd Project) seems to actually be "Aggressive Nature of Man" also from June '64 - a case of mislabeling, I presume

The show labeled "1964 spring Casey At The Bat" is definitely from 24 April 1963. My research into this supports Max's notes: Chicago's Jim Landis (cf) & Pete Ward (3b) are both mentioned as is the Yankees' Jack Reed. 1963 was Ward's first year with the Sox & Reed's last year in the bigs. 1963 was NOT, in fact, a poor year for the Yanks however - they went 104-57, but were swept in the Series by Koufax & the Dodgers.

Keep your knees loose...
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 12/02/2008 :  05:39:18  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Recent observation - the show marked 1964 Enclosed Stadium ("Enclosed Ballparks, Rationalization in Politics") appears to be the same show from 12/30/63 "Satire, Politics and Rationalization".

I'm working on going to my right...
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 05/06/2009 :  00:45:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
In case anyone's interested:
The file in circulation listed as "1965_Man_As_Machine" is actually the last 8:09 of the show from 2 Nov 1965 "American Dream Sales Pitch"

"Drop the tools, we've got you covered!"
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 09/17/2009 :  01:56:05  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
In case anyone's interested (revisited):
The show in circulation as "1963 Army Stories" is actually the second portion of the Limelight show from 23 April 1966 "Army Stories" ("Let's go burn down City Hall!!!")

"Drop the tools, we've got you covered!"
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diskojoe

161 Posts

Posted - 09/17/2009 :  11:23:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Just droppin' a note of thanks, Spiderman, on your yeoman work. I wish more people would come on & talk about Shep's programs.
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 09/19/2009 :  23:44:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks for the kind words (awww, gee whiz wow) - just trying to pitch in.

"Drop the tools, we've got you covered!"
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 09/26/2009 :  01:01:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Speaking of pitching in, this is... a further update (not WOR). It seems that the shows circulating as "Second Banana in Politics" (10 Nov. 1966) and "Age of Total Showbiz" (week of 7 Nov. 1966) are, in fact, one & the same. Go figure...

Eerily enough, Shep predicted Reagan would be elected president in this show! Well, kind of...

"Drop the tools, we've got you covered!"

Edited by - spiderman on 09/26/2009 01:09:03
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 09/27/2009 :  16:10:51  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The show circulating with the title of "1963_The Negev" (listed in the database as "Army Stories - 'Digging A Ditch' and 'In The Negev' A Limelight show rebroadcast in Boston, according to the audience station break chant" - gasp, gasp) is, in reality, the first 28:39 of "Shep's Trip to the Middle East - Part 6" from 11 June 1966.

Keep your knees loose & your glove oiled...
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 10/11/2009 :  02:28:54  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The show circulating with the title of "1966_xx_xx_Paris_Adventure" is a Boston rebroadcast of "In Paris" from 16 June 1966.

Excelsior!

"Drop the tools, we've got you covered!"
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 12/27/2009 :  02:41:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Currently going through undated 1967 shows & some clues are showing. Case in point: in "Hobbies, Potatoes, etc.", Shep mentions that it's a Monday. Later, he says that on Wednesday (or two days later), there will be a premiere of a student film at the Annenberg School in Philadelphia called "Channel 10 - In the Middle Distance" that he says "is about my show". Not only would finding that premiere date allow an accurate dating of this show, it would be interesting to uncover that film!!

My search of the Internet for anything to do with this has thus far proved feckless. Has anyone out there ever even heard of this?


Keep your knees loose & your glove oiled...

P.S. - Thanks to john~k, this show has been dated: Apr. 24, '67...

Edited by - spiderman on 03/17/2010 22:35:05
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 01/02/2010 :  02:53:51  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
1967's "Mismatings Among Ducks, Geese & Swans; Being Chased by a Goose" can, I believe, be tentatively dated. Shep plugs an upcoming appearance at Univ. of Pennsylvania's Irvine Auditorium on Dec 4 and mentions there would be no live Limelight show "this Saturday". There was a show from the Limelight on Nov 25 (and Dec 9), but NOT on Dec 2. This show MUST be from the week of Nov 27 - Dec 1.

Any one have additional info?


Also... 1967's "Tatoos" can't be from 1967. Shep's station ID identifies WOR-AM and FM. The FM simulcast stopped in July '66. This show is also not the syndicated show of the same name from 1965, although the Long Branch tattoo parlor story is told in that one also.

And... the file circulating as "1967 or 1968_Troop Train Ernie" is actually the last 16 (+/-) minutes of Shep's live show at Fairleigh Dickenson from June '67.


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...

Edited by - spiderman on 01/04/2010 02:04:16
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 02/10/2010 :  20:13:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
This just in... "Rabbits on the March, Horror Movies, Attack of the Locusts" from 1968 must be from January of that year. During the Mandarin House spot, Shep mentions that their "New Years Banquet" is available from Jan. 30 to Feb. 17. Only seems logical that this was broadcast during the last week or two of January.


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 02/27/2010 :  13:31:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
FYI - "1969 Fantasies" consists of portions of two different broadcasts from the Limelight: the first 7:47 is taken from "Army Stories" dated 23.4.66 and the remaining 27 (+/-) min. is taken from "Shep's Trip to the Middle East - 6" dated 11.6.66.

Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2010 :  04:39:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The show circulating as "Army Induction" from August '63 is actually taken from "Army Induction" of April 12, 1963



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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john~k

25 Posts

Posted - 04/13/2010 :  20:43:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi spiderman,

Got a hit on one of the shows listed in your 1/2/2010 post:

1967_Tatoos_clipped
http://ia311202.us.archive.org/2/items/JeanShepherd1967/1967_Tatoos_clipped.mp3

My brother's track index has this show airing on Monday, February 20, 1967
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 04/14/2010 :  02:44:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by john~k

Hi spiderman,

Got a hit on one of the shows listed in your 1/2/2010 post:

1967_Tatoos_clipped
http://ia311202.us.archive.org/2/items/JeanShepherd1967/1967_Tatoos_clipped.mp3

My brother's track index has this show airing on Monday, February 20, 1967



Thanks for the info, John. In that case, could this show have been a repeat? Shep does use the "WOR-AM and FM" during the station ID in this show; WOR stopped the FM simulcast in July '66.



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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john~k

25 Posts

Posted - 04/16/2010 :  11:41:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It's possible, but my guess is that it was said out of habit. I have heard him use "AM and FM" on at least one other 1967 show where he then corrected himself. One other small clue might be that his repeats are typically no more than a couple months old.

Might have an air date for "1967_Mismating_Ducks." This one is inferred. Shep mentions on the following night's show, "We will not be live at the Limelight tomorrow night." He then mentions his University of Pennsylvania appearance, "...this coming Monday, December 4th." That would give it an air date of:

1967_Mismating_Ducks
http://www.archive.org/download/JeanShepherd1967/1967_Mismating_Ducks.mp3
Thursday, November 30, 1967
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 04/18/2010 :  00:48:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by john~k

It's possible, but my guess is that it was said out of habit. I have heard him use "AM and FM" on at least one other 1967 show where he then corrected himself. One other small clue might be that his repeats are typically no more than a couple months old.

Might have an air date for "1967_Mismating_Ducks." This one is inferred. Shep mentions on the following night's show, "We will not be live at the Limelight tomorrow night." He then mentions his University of Pennsylvania appearance, "...this coming Monday, December 4th." That would give it an air date of:

1967_Mismating_Ducks
http://www.archive.org/download/JeanShepherd1967/1967_Mismating_Ducks.mp3
Thursday, November 30, 1967



Thanks for posting this, John. I, for one, really appreciate your input. If you have some for THIS one, though, that would be great. Max has "New Year's Eve at the Burly Cue" definitely dated as 30 Dec. 1964. The catch, however, is that "New Years in the Army" dated as 31 Dec. 1964 is the exact same show.

Can ANYONE (are you out there, Max?!?) clear this up? My opinion (for whatever it's worth) is that it's actually from New Years Eve. It just sounds like Shep's talking about Thursday (although he never says "today") as if it's today rather than tomorrow, and at the very end he says "Happy New Year" as if the new year is shortly upcoming - unless there was NO BROADCAST on 12/31......



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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john~k

25 Posts

Posted - 04/20/2010 :  13:15:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
spiderman, glad to help if I can. Regarding an air date for that "New_Years_in_the_Army" show. According to my brother's track index it aired on Wednesday, December 30, 1964. To confirm, I listened to the following night's show where Shep mentions preparations in Times Square and goes on to say, "...in 2 hours it will be all over."
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 05/02/2010 :  00:55:15  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello, fellow victims, fellow sufferers - heh, heh, heh...

The "Peanut Butter" episode circulating with the date of 7 July '65 is actually "Peanut Butter Anonymous" from 3 Oct. '69 and IS NOT from '65 - as is fairly clear when Shep talks about (@ 10:48 of said show) a letter he received from a fan. This guy wrote in about seeing Shep on the WCBS 6:00 news of 9/26/69 in the "first row" at a "big" Mets game. The Mets cliched the division title on 9/24 which, at that time, was the biggest game in Metropolitans history. It could not, however, have been referenced in July (or any other month) of 1965.

And thanks John for your much appreciated input. E-mail me if you would like to compare holes in each other's collections...



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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john~k

25 Posts

Posted - 05/03/2010 :  12:35:41  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
spiderman, it's interesting to note, on the show that aired 7/7/65 Shep also talked about peanut butter.
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 06/21/2010 :  02:08:12  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Recently listened to "Getting Sick in the Army" dated 1969. The database says this is "Unknown". Shep mentions he had "just got back" from an appearance he made in Buffalo at "St. Bonaventure". This live show isn't listed in the database; is anyone aware of when this occurred?


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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Chitose6970

USA
9 Posts

Posted - 06/24/2010 :  21:38:39  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The date of the “Getting Sick In The Army” show is likely Thursday, February 27, 1969. At the very beginning of the show Shep says he read an article in that day's New York Times. The article was about the “Pudding Ship” that was carrying inappropriate and otherwise useless food supplies to the hungry and suffering people of Biafra during the Nigerian Civil War.

Here is a link to a story in the St. Petersburg Times about the Pudding Ship: http://news.google.com/newspapersnid=888&dat=19690227&id=gvoNAAAAIBAJ&sjid=w3sDAAAAIBAJ&pg=7162,4687205, or else Google "Biafran Bungle Hurts Us Stature".

The credit line of the story states “From The New York Times”. If the news report was not actually printed in the two papers on the same day then at least it would be safe to assume that the show is a late February 1969 show. In the Flicklives database the show is listed as “Pudding Ship, Man of La Mancha, Army Story - Red Lined!”.

Resistance is futile but capacitance has potential.
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 09/16/2010 :  02:54:08  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
"Buying Randy a 25 cent Grab Bag for Christmas" is dated as 23 Dec. 1970 in the Show Database. Max, however, dates this as 21 Dec. 1970. Does anyone know which is correct? (besides the Shadow, of course...)

The show circulating with the date of 17 Jan 1971 "Presidents" (which doesn't appear in the DB) is, I believe, 17 Jan 1968's "Whoever Thought They Would Be President". Any additional info is welcome.


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...

Edited by - spiderman on 09/16/2010 14:18:21
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 12/10/2010 :  03:05:45  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The show "Reviews, Nostalgia" dated Oct. 1971 can be narrowed down to either 13 or 14 Oct. Shep mentions he'll be at Bloomfield College "this Saturday" which was the 16th; the 13th & 14th are the only dates that don't have shows associated with them for that week.


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silentshep

USA
7 Posts

Posted - 12/30/2010 :  20:16:00  Show Profile  Visit silentshep's Homepage  Reply with Quote

in keeping with the times, the duplicate 12/30/63 show SATIRE is actually dated 1-13-64.
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 12/31/2010 :  00:35:52  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by silentshep


in keeping with the times, the duplicate 12/30/63 show SATIRE is actually dated 1-13-64.



I unfortunately don't have that show from either date - care to trade?!? (oh, gee whiz wow...)


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jclavin

USA
45 Posts

Posted - 01/04/2011 :  16:57:24  Show Profile  Visit jclavin's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by spiderman

"Buying Randy a 25 cent Grab Bag for Christmas" is dated as 23 Dec. 1970 in the Show Database. Max, however, dates this as 21 Dec. 1970. Does anyone know which is correct? (besides the Shadow, of course...)

The show circulating with the date of 17 Jan 1971 "Presidents" (which doesn't appear in the DB) is, I believe, 17 Jan 1968's "Whoever Thought They Would Be President". Any additional info is welcome.


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...



That was a typo on my part Dec 21, 1970 is correct. The Jan 17, 1968 show was recorded by me and when it was distributed on CDs the Fatheadcentral years ago, it was mis-dated.

Jim
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 01/14/2011 :  14:58:50  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The show listed as "1971 Amateur TV" can, I believe, be accurately dated. Shep mentions the Overseas Press Club conference as happening "last week" and also mentions later that the day was Monday. The Monday following OPC was April 12.

P.S. - Thanks, Jim, for the additional info.



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 02/05/2011 :  23:21:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
1971's undated "Popular Mechanics" was from a Tuesday (Shep mentions this) & had to have been aired during the JSA run on PBS. Shep mentions that the JSA episode from the prior Sunday will be aired again "tomorrow night". That would mean this was somewhere between 13 April & 6 July 1971.

"Schools and School Topics, Jack Morton" (also from 1971) must be from the week of 28 June-2 July. Shep says that the JSA episode "Flying" (week 11 of the series) was aired "a week ago this past Sunday. Last Sunday was the 'Hawaiian' show."



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...

Edited by - spiderman on 02/05/2011 23:50:28
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 05/13/2011 :  14:12:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
"1972_Lurking Suckers" is the same show as "Kid Myths, Fleer Gum & Talking Bird" from 3 March 1972.

Also - "Theory of Evil" from March 1972 is actually the first half of "History, Etc; African Tribal Music, Presidents, Fort Monmouth to Redbank" from 22 March 1972

AND - "Bankrobbers" listed as being from April 1972 is the same show as "Robbery at Bank of America, Gangsters & Gunmen" from 18 Feb 1972


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...

Edited by - spiderman on 06/30/2011 04:31:06
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 06/30/2011 :  05:03:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The show labeled as April 1972 "Chicago Rialto" can't possibly be from April 1972. In the news before Shep comes on, Lester Smith PLAINLY says the current temperature is 22 degrees. Shep mentions later on that "Jean Shepherd's America" will be repeated over PBS BEFORE late spring. Possibly Jan or Feb 1972? Anybody know anything about this?



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...
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Chitose6970

USA
9 Posts

Posted - 07/10/2011 :  21:14:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
April 1972 very well may be the date. April can get pretty cold, I remember one year when the Mets opening day home game was called because of a blizzard. Also, I did a little poking around the Net and found that a few miles South of NYC, at the National Arboretum in Washington D.C. the low temperature on 4/8/72 was 26 degrees. Could not find data for NYC but 22 degrees is believable. I found the temp info when I used the demo at weathersource.com The URL for that search was http://weathersource.com/account/official-weather?demo-start=04%2F01%2F1972&demo-end=04%2F30%2F1972&data[temp]=temp&id=300&sid=2lkjpjggjoas28hhvjbl3bhj14&demo-mode=basic That's a lot of characters and likely won't do any good but if that does not work give the demo a try.

Spiderman, keep it up and one of these days we will get this whole date thing sorted out.








A fan since 1957

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ebruceb

USA
30 Posts

Posted - 07/12/2011 :  08:42:32  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Yes, the database is a great resource. With all my far-flung files for my original Shep book, I'm now desperately seeking the audio for the story he told of his family, to aclimate him to civilian life after the army, getting him a date with a minister's daughter. She turns out to be a "wild thing" and gets falling down drunk in a bar! I want this to cap-off my proposed book of Shep army stories. In fact, I've offered a 100 dollar reward for a usable audio of the tale. --Gene B.
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john~k

25 Posts

Posted - 07/14/2011 :  22:27:04  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Gene, can you put a date to that show? I remember transcribing such a show last year. But finding it without a more specific time reference would be difficult.
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Chitose6970

USA
9 Posts

Posted - 07/15/2011 :  18:56:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Don't recall ever hearing that show but Shep did relate this adventure in his book, A Fistful Of Fig Newtons. It is the last story in the book and is titled "The Barbi Doll Celebrates New Year's".



A fan since 1957

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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 08/01/2011 :  23:27:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Submitted for your perusal...
April 1972 "Japan" is actually a duplicate of "Trip Around the World in 7 days - Part 4" from 13 April 1972.

Also - April 1972's "Geography" & "Great Plays" can be dated from the first week (+/-) of that month, as well as "Secret Panels". Shep plugs the Red Bank, NJ show on 4/7 during each of these; "Secret Panels" also has an ad for the NY Auto Show "now through April 9th." Knowing these shows therefore had to be aired before the 7th and taking definitively dated shows from the database into account, they must be from either 4/1, 2 or 5.

Thanks, Chitose6970, for chiming in!

And Gene - I know I read that story, but I could almost swear I also heard it sometime or another. Finding it... that's the catch! I'll see what I can do.


P.S. - The show from 3 April 1972 (a Monday) can, I believe, be positively identified. It is "Memory" (from April 1972) - there is a promo for the Carlton Theater Red Bank, NJ show. That was on Friday, 7 April. Shep also says during this show that it's "the beginning of the week". According to the database, the only date unaccounted for at the beginning of that week is - ta-da! - 3 April.



Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...

Edited by - spiderman on 08/15/2011 23:43:53
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spiderman

USA
48 Posts

Posted - 10/24/2011 :  01:38:59  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi gang:

During "East Side NYC" from April '72, Shep plugs a live appearance "this Friday" at Drexel U. which was 4/28, making this show from that week prior. As usual, if anyone has any information, please share.

Also - 1972's "Airports and Sailplane" is the same show as 5/15/72's "Airports, Seaplanes, Myths"

Also revisited - Anybody know about the discrepancy of "Guinea Pigs, Horses" - the database says 6/16; the file name says 6/19 ???

And again - I believe "Minnesota" from July 1972 can be tentatively dated - right after the station break, there is an ad for NY Jets football v. the 49ers on WOR "this Saturday". As the 1972 Jets 1st game was 9/17 & didn't play the 49ers during the regular season, this is obviously referring to a preseason game. Research shows the 1st preseason games in 1972 were played on Saturday, 8/5 - making this show (if it is, in fact, from July) broadcast on Monday, July 31.


Keep your knees loose and your glove oiled...

Edited by - spiderman on 10/24/2011 14:50:18
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jclavin

USA
45 Posts

Posted - 11/08/2011 :  10:45:44  Show Profile  Visit jclavin's Homepage  Reply with Quote
[quote]Originally posted by spiderman

Hi gang:

Also revisited - Anybody know about the discrepancy of "Guinea Pigs, Horses" - the database says 6/16; the file name says 6/19 ???

From my dating notes in the database:
Based on weather and baseball scores before and after the show this was from 6/16/1972
Shep says it's Friday night
General Tire Pre 4th of July Sale
Rapid City S.D. Flooding 'a week ago' - (June 9-10)
Mets over Cinn 2-1
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